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 Naxxramas info

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PostSubject: Naxxramas info   Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:48 pm

The first hearthstone expansion comes out tomorrow, heres what we know about it right now and my initial thoughts on it

It adds a full single player campaign that allows you to unlock 30 new cards, including new legendaries, the first part of the campaign is free, the other 4 parts cost either 700 gold each or $20 for all 4

Its theme is deathrattles and it will have boss fights with bosses that have unique (unobtainable) cards and mechanics that will make you play in a different way, completing the campaign parts will unlock new neutral cards for your collection, there will also be class challenges for each class which unlocks a class card once you complete it

The Naxxramas cards

I dont see this card being used all that much, a 2/2 for 2 is meh and people rarely use secret decks, it can be fun in a secret deck though

In arena it would be the best of a bad batch, maybe

This is pretty good, its like a super cobra, at 8 hp is should be able to live too, its a bit expensive at 6 mana though, but i think its worth using in decks that have no instant removal like pally and druid

I think it would be amazing in arena

I could see this replacing shiledmasta as the go to taunt, maybe even used with shieldmasta

In arena this would be a good pick

Thaddius is really good, almost matches deathwing but has none of the downside, feugen is worth it, stalagg sucks
And i wonder if the enemies Fuegen/Stalagg dies then 1 of yours dies, will that summon a thaddius for both of you, or is it limited to just your fuegen/stalagg, it seems to imply its anyones fuegen/stalagg
I really like the idea of this though

In arena feugen would be a fine pick, stalagg no, although if i already picked feugen and had the option to pick stalagg id probably take him just to get thaddius

Omg this is brokenly powerful, imagine blessing of might on this thing, or blessing of kings, holy shit

In arena it might be the best of a mediocre batch

This copies buffs that you play during the turn, so you can blessing of kings it and have 2 5/6s at the end of the turn for example (with coin and faceless you can make 4 5/6s), i could see some good combos with this
Echo + 2x power word shield + innerfire + faceless = 4 6/6s for 10 mana
This plus the gargoyle might actually make a divine spirit/innerfire priest viable

In arena it would be decent, id rather have a 3/2 though, but since its an epic id probably end up picking it, the only epics i would pick over it are sea giant, pyro, ancient of war, faceless, gorehowl, blood knight, shade and maybe bgh, probably shadowform too

This is an interesting 1, honestly i dont know if its good or bad, it will shut decks like aggro mage, shockadin and zoo down hard since pulling a minion from their deck doesnt really matter since all their stuff is crap but against control its really bad
Its something id have to use or see in action before i could say 1 way or the other, im glad it exists though as it may reduce the number of aggro decks just by existing in the game

In arena this could be disastrous or amazing depending on the RNG result, id pick it against garbage cards though

Omg, another OP card, 4/6 for 5 is good and its ability makes it a super fairy dragon, you can give this guy taunt with argus/sunfury and be immune to all burst combos if youve been holding board control, great addition to the game

In arena id probably pick this any time it was offered, unless i already had 2 (id be willing to go to 3 depedning on the rest of the deck) or if the other choices were amazing, or way too many 5 cost cards

This card seems counter productive to me, maybe it will work as an aggro card but i dont think it will, i think this would be better in a midrange control deck instead of argent squire that people have been using, the health they gain doesnt really matter there, probably only 1 in the deck though (1 of these and 1 squire for example)

In arena id pick it over other 2/3s and over other 1 cost minions (except maybe worgen infiltrator and depending on how the deck is at the time abusive sergeant), but not over any 3/2 (except maybe raptor) or any other card, but id only ever put 1 in an arena deck in all circumstances

I have to wonder if they were trying to design a card to directly counter miracle rogue and freeze mage style play, cause thats what this does, and i guess its not bad, id rather have instants, but this is a good compromise, this with spectral knight means that miracle rogue will disappear from the meta for a while, freeze mage will probably stick around

In arena there are better legendaries that you could pick, but if its against crap legendaries, or meh legendaries then its a fine pick

I dont know if "spectral" is a thing now, like are the 1/1 immune to spells/hero power like spectral knight is, or is it just part of their name
If they arent immune then its a pretty good card, if they are then its an amazing card, like a mini harvest golem, and it counts as a beast for hunters too

Id pick it in arena over 2/1s, 1/1s, river croc and raptor

Holy fucking shit wtf, this is an amazing card and i love this kind of mechanic but, first of all, his effect is not a battle cry, its on going, which means every turn its up you get your guys back including the turn that you play him and your enemy's turns, thats ridiculous, second, hes a 6/8 so hes immune to bgh, basically if your opponent cant remove/silence him within a turn or 2 you win the game, so pally is screwed
Im certain he will be nerfed asap

In arena... do i even need to say it, you pick this no matter what

A very strange idea, it feels like it counters zoo and only zoo, being a 1/4 and effecting battle cry minions is very anti zoo, i dont see it being used that much after the initial release, zoo should be out of the meta with this release because of this and the 2/8 taunt

In arena its a meh card, there are better 2s to pick

Much like the weblord this card seem to counter shockadin, and only shockadin, i guess they both counter aggro in general but i feel like they had those specific counters in mind when these 2 cards

In arena, again its meh, not good not bad, there are better 2s

This card lets you pull off some cool combos with the other new cards, i could see it being used in new decks that center around that idea, but it doesnt fit in the old decks, i see it being used in a new aggro deck, maybe, the card art is way cooler then what he can do though

In arena i cant really say if id pick it, while a 3/5 for 4 mana is good the silence thing can screw you so its highly dependent on the rest of the deck, if theres not alot that will get negatively effected by the silence id take it

This is basically the same as a secret keeper, but with deathrattle cards instead

I probably wouldnt pick it in arena, my choices would have to be pretty crap for me to pick it

Its like a smaller version of gruul, i could see this being amazing in a priest deck where you buff its hp so it cant die to aoe (not counting equality), but i dont think it will be in many normal decks

In arena id probably pick it since its an epic and there arent many good epics for arena and this one looks pretty good in arena, the only epics i would pick over it are sea giant , pyro, ancient of war, gorehowl and faceless
Having to pick between this and bloodknight would be a very very tough choice, i would need experience with shade before i could make that call, but right now id say bloodknight over shade

This is a weird one, youd have to buff it to get it too attack so it dies, or give it taunt, i guess you could use a 2 dmg battle cry to kill it too, like on turn 5 with rogue, play this then SI-7 agent to kill it and have a 4/4 and a 3/3, you could also backstab it on turn 2 for a really early 4/4, you could even coin egg, backstab on turn 1 for a turn 1 4/4
I dont think it will be used in normal decks though, maybe in zoolock since they can buff it to attack but even then its not great since it messes with the tempo of that deck

In arena, the rest of the deck would need to have a good amount of buffs to make me consider picking this but even then the other choices would have to be pretty bad to make me pick this

I could see this in aggro decks, but its stopped fairly easily so idk if people will actaully use it

In arena id pick it if my early game was crap, and id take it over garbage cards

I want this card, i want to make a shaman deck that uses cairne and ancestral spirit with this card, play cairne in 1 turn, then when there is something on the board that can kill cairne, play this card and put ancestral spirit on cairne then send carine into that minion to kill him to get a fresh cairne and 2 banes, its probably really impractical but i dont care, im doing it

I probably would never pick this in arena, there are better legendaries


The minion that receives the buff is random, it caused some confusion and the someone from blizz said that it is random, they shouldve put that in the text cause i assumed you could target it
And its a pretty crappy card, +3/+2 is powerful, but the concept of the card conflicts with the pallies hero ability, since its likely to give +3/+2 to one of your 1/1s, so its like summoning a 4/3 on your enemies turn which is fairly easy for most classes to deal with, i guess it is annoying though especially since theres no way to remove secrets unless you play hunter and use flare (im hoping this expansion adds a neutral way to remove secrets without triggering them)
I think it would be better to just deal 3 dmg to the character that killed the minion that caused this secret to trigger (the hero would take 3 damage if the secret was triggered by a spell or hero power)

In arena i probably wouldnt pick it unless my choices sucked


This has some crazy synergy with the new deathrattle stuff but i dont see it being used at high ranks like that, i would actually want to use it as single target removal, like a worse version of polymoph, only because druid removal kindve sucks, use it on a rag after it clears your last minion for example, or as a massive insta board clear with thalnos and swipe to the face, i will definitely try it out in my druid deck
This doesnt fit in my deck but something like violet teacher, innervate, innervate, coin, claw, claw, wrath, wrath, poison seeds, power of the wild would be fun for a token druid, fill the board with 3/3s (and then cry when your awesome 10 card combo is burned by a single flamestrike)
If the treants from this had charge it would be useful in any druid deck imo (you could deal 20 dmg in 1 turn with force of nature, savage roar, innervate, coin (or your other innervate if you didnt go second), poison seeds, which sounds OP but it does take 5 cards to pull off and is actually the same as doing force of nature, innervate, innervate, druid of the claw (charge form), savage roar)

In arena i might pick it if the rest of the deck was pretty good and the other choices were meh


This card may replace 1 fiery war axe in warrior control (i would use this in place of 1 of them) since dealing 1 dmg to your own stuff is great for that deck, im pretty sure the 1 dmg would go off when the opponent plays ooze too, im not sure what would happen if they use harrison though, i guess it would still trigger since the card text says "destroy"

Id pick it in arena, it looks great for arena


A 5/5 for 4 mana is ridiculous, i know a light spawn is a 5/5 for 4 but it can be silenced/dmged to be made weaker so its not that bad, but a 5/5 thats just a 5/5 is really strong, it can kill a yeti in 1 shot and stay alive, its only downside is its death rattle, which isnt even really a downside, this card could be amazing in tempo rogue (im assuming you can pick the minion that gets returned, if its random then maybe not so much, it also needs to live for a turn or it could slow your tempo, but it has 5hp so it will probably live)

Easy pick in arena, though id still pick yeti over this, probably


Ok this card is just OP, i was just talking about Ancestral Spirit, which does something similar (Rebirth was announced after my post about Ancestral Spirit
For comparison heres spirit:
The new card does the same thing for the same mana cost but gets results instantly while you have to kill the guy with spirit manually, so rebirth is just flat out better
The worst part is you can combo them together to legitimately make 3 rags without needing to be against a priest with thoughtsteal or any other random set of circumstances
Imagine it on sylvanas, turn 10 you can do sylvanas, spirit, rebirth for a 10 mana mind control and 2 5/5s that will steal more minions when they die

I dont think i would ever pick this in arena, maybe if i ended up with spirit, but even then, probably not


3/4 for 4 mana is pretty bad, and pulling a demon from your hand isnt that great, the best thing it could pull is doomguard, i could see it being used in zoo, maybe, the main problem is that it doesnt really fit the mana curve for zoo, other than zoo though i dont see any potential use for it, its not like it makes a demon warlock viable, i mean sure you can do cute things like power over whelming on the void caller attack with it then play void terror to absorb it and get another demon out, but i dont think thats a viable combo, maybe shadowflame instead of void terror, but still the demon cards are just so bad that a demon deck is probably still not going to be viable

Id pick it over garbage in arena


This is the kind of card that looks amazing on paper, but i dont think it is, you cant control which minion dies since it happens on the enemy turn, so its too inconsistent, it might have a place in some decks though so i wont say its useless, and those times where it works out like you want would be amazing (like if it gives you 2 sylvanas's or something and steals a minion when the first sylvanas dies)

Would never pick it in arena


This card might be amazing, a 3/4 for 3 mana is good, and its ability is decent enough, the minion it gives hp to is random even though it doesnt say its random (all deathrattle effects are random when targeting is involved), but even then its still not bad, i think this could help priest a lot

Easy pick in arena, would take it in most cases


At first i thought this just drew a random beast from your deck and was like, well thats crap, maybe the worst card in the expansion so far
But then i found out that its ANY random beast in the game, not from your deck, it works like ysera where it gives you a card from no where, any beast includes king krush and highmane
So its much better than i first thought, i could see it being used in beast synergy decks, though i dont think it will be consistent enough to be used in high level decks, you could get king krush or you could get captain's parrot, random is random

In arena i would take  this over worgen inf or leper gnome, cause the RNG is worth it, its like a crappy harvest golem with the potential to be amazing, but against other cards i wouldnt take it

Conclusion on the new cards
Im glad to see they are trying to stop burst and aggro with these new cards, but i feel like its just going to create an entirely new and worse aggro

Ive already made a new fun deck:

And an actual attempt at a real deck:
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PostSubject: Re: Naxxramas info   Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:51 pm

pat wrote:
(Referring to Maexxna)
This is pretty good, its like a super cobra, at 8 hp is should be able to live too, its a bit expensive at 6 mana though, but i think its worth using in decks that have no instant removal like pally and druid

I think it would be amazing in arena
so earlier today i played arena. got mage and then pulled an amazing deck. my final pick was between Maexxna, Leeroy, and The Beast. i somehow didn't see a single polly (but the rest of my deck made it a-ok) so i picked maexxna as a sort of creature polly that would at the worst be awkward since so new
the first 3 games were against amazing decks and mine stomped them. i went 7-0 ez mode. i then lost my next 3 games by 1hp (two games) and 22hp (1 game) because maexxna sucks dick in arena.

this is for a few reasons. many cards have strong battlecries targeting creatures with >2-3 hp. they were very occasionally great, and usually a solid play for card advantage + solidifying a lead.
a lot of people also happen to pick these cards, just because simple aggro control with just a really solid deck is a good way to go in arena

in the 3 that lost it maexxna took
1. a stampeding kodo from pally (very common rare in arena):
that gave me a minor disadvantage that i didn't recover from. it was one of those crazy games that just stays focused on board control even after a few clears with both sides drawing bad cards for winning it but excellent cards for countering the other persons cards
2. a cabal shadow priest from priest:
the game was close but i had better cards even though he had more options. maexxna had been out for a few turns to attempt to force awkward plays (which she didn't). eventually he got this out of comboing the heal=draw cleric + youthful panda + drawing into stall taunts and/or spells
3. a shadow madness from priest:
he'd played 1 already and had 2 in hand so i figured it would MAYBE take a shadow word so i put it out there -- again to force awkward plays. it sorta worked. i lost this 22-0

yeah it was just bad luck that those were all back to back, but those cards aren't crazy uncommon. add that to maexxna doing fuck all each game (the best she ever did was get owled, youthful panda'd back to hand after hitting a 4/2 weirdly played avenger, and then owl'd a 2nd time the turn after)
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PostSubject: Re: Naxxramas info   Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:20 pm

Lol that is really unlucky to have 3 in a row like that, but i dont think that means maexx is bad, it would be like saying twilight drake is bad because owl/earthshock/spellbreaker all can kill it

Against priest you do have to be more careful though, in fact i wouldnt even play it until i was desperate or gave them decent shadow madness/cabal targets for them to take instead (im surprised you saw that many priests in arena at 7 wins) and for kodo people wont hold cards on the off chance you have maexx in arena, so just give them another good kodo target and if they dont take it you can assume its safe, again i would only play it when i was desperate or relatively certain it is safe

That said, i would have taken the beast over maexx there, since its hp is only 1 less then maexx and its attack is high enough to basically destroy minions anyway (with the added bonus of being able to heavily damage the enemy hero) and it costs the same, that plus if the rest of the deck is really strong already the 3/3 that they can get doesnt really matter (the beast is much stronger in arena than it is in constructed due to most decks not having as many spells since arena decks tend to be minion heavy)
Although since its a new card i may have taken it just cause its new but i wouldve lost like you did and wouldve learned a lesson about not taking cards just because they are new

Also how do you get legendaries every time you do an arena lol, i think ive only ever gotten 1, and it wasnt a good one because i cant remember which one it was

So ive used all the new cards for awhile, heres what i think of them after actually using them

Anubar Ambusher is as good as i thought it would be in constructed, it always gets a fireball or some other removal spell and if it doesnt you are way ahead and will probably win if you get it out early enough

Nerubian egg is better then i thought (still wouldnt pick it in arena), every zoo deck is using it and 90% of people are playing zoo right now with this card and haunted creeper, i said it would mess with the tempo of zoo, but it turns out tempo doesnt actually matter to zoo, since all their stuff is low cost anyway they can just delay when they play the egg to a time when they have something else low cost to play with it, i think overall it does make them slower though
In my druid deck it prevents people from using aoe to clear my tokens, and if they do use aoe i end up with a 4/4 afterwards, i just have to make sure the egg lives until they are forced to use aoe (which is easy since people avoid killing it like i want)

Anubar Weblord is surprisingly good in constructed, ive only used it in my druid deck where i have no minions with batlecry though, but it delays zoo and some other aggro, it screws preist pretty hard (cause they cant play blademaster until turn 5), it messes with handlock because they cant play drake, if you play it before or on turn 4 its great, after that point though it starts to suck, its really bad in the late game

Haunted creeper really is like a mini harvest golem, its so much of a pain to get rid of all of it that people will just ignore it since it only deals 1 dmg, which means its guaranteed to be alive to receive a buff in a later turn, but it really only works in decks that have ways to buff minions (its amazing with power of the wild)

Maexxna is good, originally i had maexxna in my druid deck with mark of nature, and maexxna/mark of nature was really powerful, but it didnt fit the deck since its token druid so i took them out, might make a priest deck with it
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PostSubject: Re: Naxxramas info   Wed Aug 06, 2014 3:27 pm

So my nax finally unlocked on sunday, i held off on posting about it until the next wing unlocked, which it has

Sludge Belcher is as good as i thought it would be

Stoneskin gargoyle isnt as good as i thought it was, even when you put blessing of kings on it, since it heals at the start of your turn it isnt as hard to get rid of with damage as i thought, plus people are using a lot of silence because of all the new nax cards

Deathlord is great against zoo/aggro and terrible against everything else

Spectral Knight is OP against everything except zoo, could be put into any deck, even decks that use buff spells, if you give it taunt you win against everything except for the heavy board control decks like shaman

Loatheb could be put into any deck too, it really screws your opponent, it is bad against zoo though

Unstable goul is unimpressive, good in control warrior (arguably) not much use otherwise

Dancing swords, i didnt play enough games after i beat nax last night to even see this card, and i didnt use it myself so i dont know

Baron Riverdale is ok, i did the combo that i talked about back when i first posted about this card with reincarnate too, but it seems like a waste because reincarnate can already make like 4 cairnes with ancestral spirit and you never have enough space on the board with totem/baron for 8 cairnes so i replaced it with thalnos

Reincarnate is really OP, like it needs to be nerfed or something
I made this shaman deck:
I want to fit azure drake and sylvanas in there (once i get sylvanas), with sylvanas you can mind control for 2 mana (you invest 8 total mana but since you get sylvanas back the MC only cost you 2 mana), you can also reincarnate a deathlord for a 2 mana mindgames from your deck to try to pull an earth elemental on turn 3/4 without the overlord cost, and reincarnate can act as a silence in some situations
Basically for that deck i just stall the game with early removal (maybe get a 4/4 out of the egg early on with rockbiter/flametongue, wait till they cant deal with 1 of the big guys in that deck and then do the big combo, if i feel like im behind then i wont save them for the big combo, ill just use it on egg or harvest
The big combo, if you cant see it for some reason, is double ancestral spirit on earth ele/carine, then reincarnate for 3 earth eles/cairne(and a bane)

Voidcaller actually has a use in zoo, or at least ive seen zoo use it to try to get a free doomgaurd out, void terror is in some zoo now too, so it is better than i thought, it still doesnt make a demon deck viable, it just helps zoo cheat out a doomgaurd

Duplicate is better than i thought, even though you almost will never get the dream combo getting 2 copies of a random minion back is nice, its like drawing 2 cards and the only cards you can draw are the ones that are currently on the board
It might even not be that bad in arena

Webspinner is just a gimmick card
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PostSubject: Re: Naxxramas info   Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:22 am

So now that all the cards are out and ive used them for a bit i feel like i can talk about them

Theres a new zoo deck that uses voidcaller really well, with a few extra demons, so it is better than i thought

Dancing swords sucks, its 4/4 stats arent good enough to justify the draw back that it has
If it was a 4/5 then maybe, but as it is now its a much worse bladmaster
It does have a place in mill decks though

Deathlord isnt "terrible against everything else" like i said in the other post if you are playing pally, since it forces them to play a minion that will get caught in the equality combo, it could work for any deck that has huge aoe, pally is probably the best for it though

Webspinner is used in the main hunter deck right now, its as random as i thought it would be, but you dont rely on the random beast that you get, its just a bonus, the point of it is more of a tempo play or as a quick deal 3 dmg with houndmaster, deal 5 with kill command, or as an emergency taunt, people generally wont kill it with minions so youll have a beast up a lot of the time after you play it

Dark cultist is amazing, ill probably put it in every priest deck i make from now one, good stats, nice ability as a bonus

Death's Bite is really good, the 1 dmg across the board is great in control warrior, and against certain classes like hunter, its a bit too expensive to replace fireywar axe, but they are great together

Poison seeds sucks, i tried so hard to make it work, i could never use it in a way that benefits me and its suicidal to use against shaman/pally, its just really clunky and unreliable, requiring a very specific board state to actually be beneficial to you

Avenge is better than i thought but i still dont think its good, in a secrets focused deck that i made its not bad, but i dont think its viable in any other deck type

Undertaker is great in deathrattle heavy decks, its the kind of card you need to build a deck around, like secret keeper, but unlike secret keeper, deathrattle minions are really good and you could actually make a full deck of like 20-25 deathrattle cards and it would work where as thats impossible with secrets

Shade of naxramas can really snowball out of control, but its so slow i dont think its good
Its hard to tell, i made a super slow priest deck with it and blademaster to compare which one is better and blade usually came out on top, especially when i also had circle, the main problem with shade is that it wants power word shield but so does pyro, and pyro/shield is way better so it doesnt really combo the way i wanted, plus bladmaster cant be silenced

Wailing soul is terrible, you cant make a deck where you want to silence your own minions because, 1 you only have 2 wailing souls, and 2 if you top deck wailing souls late game with minions that you dont want to silence on the board (likea taunt) then your screwed

Unstable ghoul also stops unleash the hounds which is really nice, and it does deal 2 damage to whatever hits it last so its better than i thought

Stoneskin gargoyle and echoing ooze are no where near as good as i thought they could be in a buff deck, maybe if priest could draw cards like miracle rouge so that you were guaranteed to draw the combos for them then maybe priest could work, but pally just doesnt, the kings combo is just to slow and not good enough, plus the gargoyle heals at the start of your turn so its not even that hard to kill after it trades even when you get a combo off

Sludge belcher is amazing, its my go to taunt now replacing sen'jin, the 2nd taunt it spawns basically guarantees that your stuff is protected for that turn

Mad scientist is better than i thought, it works even in beast hunter and is great in mage without even going all in on the secrets, its like loothoarder but plays the card it draws right away for free and only draws secrets, if/when more classes get secrets i could see mad scientist being used in a lot of decks

Stallag and Feugen... im really dissapointed in this, i really want these cards to work i made a really fun shaman deck that i kept refining trying to get it to work but it just doesnt work
Heres the deck: Arise
You can see what i was going for with reincarnate on kelthuzad to have infinitely respawning minions or on stallag/fuegen to summon thaddius right away and still have fuegen/stallag, or just on cairne for more banes, if i had sylvanas she would be in instead of cairne, but even with that i dont think the deck would be any better
I wish this worked but sadly it doesnt

Kel'thuzad is OP, way OP, in that shaman deck, when i get the combo rolling its amazing, but its unreliable there
So i made another deck, the most OP deck ever: Unstoppable Uther
If i had lay on hands, that holy light would be lay on hands (id also want to shove sylvanas in there if i had her, probably 1 sunwalker for sylvanas, id have to play a few games to see)
This deck has only lost a single game (to a druid) out of about 10, its crazy, and most of the games i ended up with kel behind tirion and they were just screwed, a couple games i did equality kel, traded all my board for his, and then got all my guys back, so it acted as a full board wipe and a full board heal at the same time, i even did ysera awakens into kel in 1 game to get all the guys that died back, its insane
Basically they just run out of answers by the time i play kel and i become unstoppably invincible, its great with acolyte of pain too because you can draw a card every turn that kel is up for free
The only reason i lost that 1 game was because i didnt draw sludge/sunwalker/healing at all, plus druid is really good at taking out deathlords fairly quickly because of innervate and a variaty of ways to deal 4 damage
The only thing this is weak to is other pallies with equality combos, and a super powered shadowflame/bladeflurry, but if you can get them to burn those without playing too much it could work
Also i have to make sure kel and deathlord arent up at the same time, it happened once when i wasnt paying attention and was almost disastrous, was hilarious though
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